The Tarot Podcast with T. Susan Chang

Episode 34: Can I Use Tarot in a Magic Spell? with Judika Illes

As tarot readers, we specialize in divination—but what about magic?  Magic and divination are two sides of the same coin—but in this week’s episode we bring them together. How we can use the symbolic language of tarot to create a magic spell? Spoiler alert: it’s easier than you think.
My guest is Judika Illes, who has written so many books devoted to magic spells, spirits, and witchcraft. My favorite is the best-selling Encyclopedia of 5000 Spells, which is off my bookshelf more often than it’s on it, that’s how much I use it. Judika is also a teacher, a reader, an editor, and a practitioner of the very arts she writes about. So gather up your witchy herbs, give your cards a shuffle, and settle in as we search for answers to the question: Can I Use Tarot in a Magic Spell?
Judika Illes is a lifelong lover, student, and practitioner of the magical arts. She is the author of numerous books devoted to magic spells, spirits, witchcraft, and saints, including the best-sellers Encyclopedia of 5000 Spells and Encyclopedia of Spirits, as well as the creator of two card decks: Magic Spells Oracle and Protection Spells. Her other books include Pure Magic: A Complete Course in Spellcasting, Encyclopedia of Witchcraft, Witches: A Compendium, and Daily Magic, a perpetual calendar of spells, rituals, and feasts. A certified aromatherapist, Judika has been a professional tarot card reader since 1988.  She teaches about spell-casting and other topics in the US and internationally, live and virtually.
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AuthorJudikaIlles Instagram: @judikailles
Books mentioned in the episode:
Encyclopedia of 5000 Spells
Pure Magic
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Episode 33: Five Questions with the Motherpeace Tarot creators

The Motherpeace Tarot (familiarly known as “you know, the round deck” in the tarot community) is a foundational document of the modern tarot era. First self-published in 1981, the Motherpeace revolutionized the world of tarot decks. Its creators, Vicki Noble and Karen Vogel, set out to dismantle the patriarchal underpinnings of traditional tarot with cards that honored indigenous, pre-historic, and matriarchal cultures.
In today’s conversation, Motherpeace’s creators share a glimpse of the psychic foment of 1970’s Berkeley, California. They tell the story of how two feminist academics found the Goddess, and sought to express and uphold her presence by changing the practice of divination from the ground up.
In the reading we did at the end of the show, we drew the "Shaman of Wands" (equivalent to the King of Wands in Rider Waite Smith-type decks). Here is the image, for your reference.
 
Pick up a copy of the Motherpeace Tarot: 
motherpeace.com
 
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 😊 And...don't forget to like, rate, subscribe, and share!! 😊
Vicki Noble is a feminist healer and wisdom teacher, co-creator of Motherpeace and author of numerous books, including Shakti Woman and The Double Goddess. For decades she has traveled and taught internationally; her books are translated and published in various languages. Retired from teaching as a graduate professor in two Women’s Spirituality Masters Programs in California, she teaches regularly in Europe. At home she works as a professional astrologer and healer, adapting Tibetan Buddhist Dakini practices for her Goddess students and holding private intensives in Santa Cruz, California.
Karen Vogel, co-creator of Motherpeace, is widely known as as a tarot reader, teacher and writer as well as an extraordinary artist. She is the author of The Motherpeace Tarot Guidebook (1995), the novel Coyote Tails (2007), and the essays “Love of the Goddess” (Foremothers of the Womens Spirituality Movement ed. Miriam Robbins Dexter and Vicki Noble 2015) and “Female Shamanism, Goddess Cultures, and Psychedelics” (ReVision, winter 2003). The worldwide success of the Motherpeace Deck (currently over 500,000 in print) has afforded her the time to develop as an artist and sculptor of wood and stone as well as continue her exploration of the intermountain and far west. She has a degree in anthropology and a background in women’s studies, art and shamanism.
 
 

Episode 32: The 7 of Wands in Real Life

In this episode, we examine how the 7 of Wands shows up in the lives of regular folks—like you and me.
The 7 of Wands explodes onto the scene with the individualistic quest energy we will come to associate with Sevens. Challenging and courageous, the 7 of Wands is known as the Lord of Valor. When you draw it, look out for the following themes:
Courage/Standing Up for Yourself
Perseverance
Exertion/Exercise
Hardship/Fighting
Horses! or Going places
Inspiration
Literal 7’s/Counting to 7
For my brief intro to decans, see episode 06: 2 of Wands + intro to decans.
To share your stories about the 8 of Wands for the next Tarot in Real Life segment - please join as a Patreon supporter of the Tarot Podcast!You can also write in to the show at thetarotpodcast.com/about, using the contact form at the bottom of the page.
 ________________________________
Become a Tarot Podcast member! patreon.com/thetarotpodcast
Shop for Tarot Podcast MERCH! & cool stuff made by your host! etsy.com/shop/tarotista
Sign up for readings and explore books and classes!thetarotpodcast.com
Continue your tarot journey with The Living Tarot book and/or The Living Tarot online class (discount for class available if you purchase the book!)

Episode 31: Do Archetypes Power the Tarot? with Deb & Joseph from This Jungian Life

In this episode, Deborah Stewart and Joseph Lee  from This Jungian Life return to the Tarot Podcast to talk about the commonly misunderstood Jungian concept of the archetype.  What are they? and what do  they have to do with tarot—if anything?  Thinking about archetypes is notoriously tricky, but your intrepid hosts give it their best shot, peering into the depths  of depth psychology…and hunting for a glimpse of the cards.
Deborah Stewart is a Jungian analyst, Gestalt therapist, and Licensed Clinical Social Worker who migrates between Cape Cod and Sarasota, Florida. She is a member of the Philadelphia Association of Jungian Analysts and the Inter-Regional Society of Jungian Analysts. She also is a graduate of the Westchester Institute for Training in Psychotherapy and Psychoanalysis.
Joseph R. Lee is a Jungian Analyst who co-hosts the podcast This Jungian Life and co-created Dream School, an online program that teaches dream interpretation. He lectures widely on the Western Mystery Tradition and Hermetic Qabalah. His teaching and clinical work are informed by almost five decades of research and practice with Tarot and other symbolic systems.
This Jungian Life [podcast]: Three Jungian analysts discuss myth, mental health and life
Dream School: An online self-paced course in dream interpretation
Dream Wise: Unlocking the Meaning of Your Dreams[book]
Become a Tarot Podcast member! patreon.com/thetarotpodcast
Shop for Tarot Podcast MERCH! & cool stuff made by your host! etsy.com/shop/tarotista
Sign up for readings and explore books and classes!thetarotpodcast.com
😊 And...don't forget to like, rate, subscribe, and share!! 😊

Episode 30: The New Year's Spread

Want a super-simple spread that will tell you one unexpected and interesting thing! about your 2026? Well, here you go!  Forget about the Celtic Cross, forget about the “Wheel of the Year”—with just two cards, tarot can offer you a relevant and specific scene from the year ahead, tailored just for you.
If you’ve enjoyed this spread and would like to learn how to design your own simple spreads, check out my book, The Living Tarot, available wherever books are sold.  Or, consider The Living Tarot online class (discount for class available if you purchase the book – just message me.)
If you try the New Year’s Spread, let me know how it works out! Write to me on the Tarot Podcast Discord server (if you’re a Patreon member - to sign up and support the podcast, visit patreon.com/thetarotpodcast). Or you can reach me through the contact form at thetarotpodcast.com.
Here’s the 2026 Decan Reference Chart for you to consult when you do this spread!
 
Become a Tarot Podcast member! patreon.com/thetarotpodcast
Shop for Tarot Podcast MERCH! & cool stuff made by your host! etsy.com/shop/tarotista
Sign up for readings and explore books and classes!thetarotpodcast.com
Continue your tarot journey with The Living Tarot book and/or The Living Tarot online class (discount for class available if you purchase the book!)
😊 And...don't forget to like, rate, subscribe, and share!! 😊

Episode 29: Five Questions with Jamie Sawyer + the Out of Hand Tarot

Indie tarot artist Jamie Sawyer has created many decks, of which my favorite is today’s showcase: the Out of Hand Tarot.  Drawn (mostly) from a first-person perspective and packed with sly references to the Rider Waite Smith tarot, Out of Hand invites you to step into the cards and experience those familiar archetypal presences in a 21st-century setting. Jamie’s decks have limited print runs and sell out quickly, but she has made this one available again through the modern magic of print-on-demand!
And be sure to check out this week’s video bonus content for patrons, where you can watch a time-lapse video of one of Jamie’s cards evolving from start to finish: patreon.com/thetarotpodcast.
Jamie Sawyer is an artist who enjoys exploring the many ways that creativity weaves through the tapestry of life. From a career in tattooing that has spanned over 2 decades to learning the Tarot and its lessons via illustrating the art and archetypes, Jamie has developed a unique artistic style. A self-proclaimed “creatrix with a busy mind and a lack of vices,” Jamie has self-published over 10 divination decks (including tarot, oracle and Lenormand). She also is known for her miniature handmade heirloom resin and wood “Tarot Tiles,” a tactile way to experience some of her creations. Her preferred method of connecting with the Tarot is through layered readings using the many creative divination tools she makes.
 
Where to find Jamie:
Explore Jamie’s website! https://www.jamiesawyer336.comBuy decks at Jamie’s print-on-demand shop! https://www.makeplayingcards.com/sell/jamiesawyer336Support Jamie on Patreon! https://www.creativedivination.comIG: @jamiesawyer336YouTube: @Jamiesawyer336Substack: https://jamiesawyer.substack.com
 
✯ MORE TAROT GIFT IDEAS for the holidays! ✯
✯ TSC’s Etsy shop ✯ 
etsy.com/shop/tarotista 
Arcana Cases
elemental and zodiacal perfumes
custom perfumes based on your sun, moon, and rising!
8 of Wands talisman key chains and luggage tags
9 of Swords blankets
Tarot Podcast merch!
✯ Gift certificates for readings and classes ✯www.tsusanchang.com/shop
✯ The Tarot Podcast memberships & gift memberships ✯www.patreon.com/thetarotpodcast
✯ The Living Tarot Online Class ✯www.tsusanchang.com/class
✯ Readings with TSC ✯www.tsusanchang.com/readings
✯ TSC books ✯
Dreaming the Decans (hc/pb): www.lulu.com/shop/t-susan-chang/dreaming-the-decans/hardcover/product-v8kqed2.html
36 Secrets (hc/pb): https://www.lulu.com/shop/t-susan-chang/36-secrets/paperback/product-zzrd79
The Living Tarot: https://www.amazon.com/Living-Tarot-Connecting-Everyday-Readings/dp/0738772259
Tarot Correspondences: https://www.amazon.com/Tarot-Correspondences-Ancient-Secrets-Everyday/dp/0738755125
Tarot Deciphered: https://www.amazon.com/Tarot-Deciphered-Decoding-Esoteric-Symbolism/dp/0738764477
😊 And...don't forget to like, rate, subscribe, and share!! 😊

Episode 28: Can Looking at Art Help Me Read Tarot?

In today’s episode, we plunge into the world of the image with artomancer Laetitia Barbier! 
When we enter into a tarot reading, we look at the pictures on the cards in a particular way. And when we enter a gallery or museum, we look at the paintings hanging on the walls in another way. How are these two ways of looking different? Do they need to be? Can looking at art teach you to read tarot? Or to put it the other way: Can reading tarot teach you to look at art?  Could museums really be portals to a spirit dimension, in disguise?!  So. Many. Questions!
Laetitia has long haunted the unfathomable intersection of art and magic, so who better to ask? Our conversation opened many doors for me – and I look forward to hearing what you think.
 
French-born Laetitia Barbier is an independent scholar, as well as a professional tarot reader and teacher. She earned a Bachelor's Degree in Art History from La Sorbonne University Paris in 2009. Laetitia has worked with Morbid Anatomy from 2012 to 2024 as a programming director, head librarian, and occasional curator. Her book Tarot and Divination Cards: A Visual Archive was published in 2021 with a foreword by Rachel Pollack. Along with her friend Lou Benesch, she’s the co-creator the Camena Tarot. As a writer and scholar, she has the privilege of collaborating with the iconic French maître-cartier Grimaud, notably on the exquisite re-release of their 1930s Tarot de Marseille and Belline Oracle.
Laetitia has lectured, taught and read cards for various cultural institutions, such as Greenwood Cemetery, Artyard,  Fotografiska NY, the College of Psychic Studies in London or the New York Public Library. She lives in Brooklyn, New York.
Check out Tarot and Divination Cards: A Visual Archivehttps://www.amazon.com/Tarot-Divination-Cards-Visual-Archive/dp/1419756370
Explore Laetitia’s events, readings, and classes:https://laetitiacartomancy.com
Join Laetitia’s Patreon communityhttps://www.laetitiacartomancy.com/patreon
✯ TAROT GIFT IDEAS for the holidays! ✯
✯ TSC’s Etsy shop ✯ https://etsy.com/shop/tarotista 
Arcana Cases
elemental and zodiacal perfumes
custom perfumes based on your sun, moon, and rising!
8 of Wands talisman key chains and luggage tags
9 of Swords blankets
Tarot Podcast merch!
✯ Gift certificates for readings and classes ✯www.tsusanchang.com/shop
✯ The Tarot Podcast memberships and gift memberships ✯www.patreon.com/thetarotpodcast
✯ The Living Tarot Online Class ✯www.tsusanchang.com/class
✯ Readings with TSC ✯www.tsusanchang.com/readings
✯ TSC books ✯
Dreaming the Decans (hc/pb): www.lulu.com/shop/t-susan-chang/dreaming-the-decans/hardcover/product-v8kqed2.html
36 Secrets (hc/pb): https://www.lulu.com/shop/t-susan-chang/36-secrets/paperback/product-zzrd79
The Living Tarot: https://www.amazon.com/Living-Tarot-Connecting-Everyday-Readings/dp/0738772259
Tarot Correspondences: https://www.amazon.com/Tarot-Correspondences-Ancient-Secrets-Everyday/dp/0738755125
Tarot Deciphered: https://www.amazon.com/Tarot-Deciphered-Decoding-Esoteric-Symbolism/dp/0738764477
😊 And...don't forget to like, rate, subscribe, and share!! 😊

Episode 27: The 6 of Wands in Real Life

In this episode, we examine how the 6 of Wands shows up in the lives of ordinary humans like you and me.
With our first 6, the suit of Wands finds its purpose in life and starts to shine with the glow of empowerment! which is why it’s called the Lord of Victory.  When you draw it, look out for the following themes:
Pride/Accomplishments
Favorable Health Outcomes
Good News/Generous Acts
Fame/Recognition/Winning
Horses! or Going places
Literal/Visual Rhymes
To share your stories about the 7 of Wands for the next Tarot in Real Life segment - please join as a Patreon supporter of the Tarot Podcast!You can also write in to the show at thetarotpodcast.com/about, using the contact form at the bottom of the page.
✯✯✯ TAROT GIFT IDEAS for the holidays! ✯✯✯
✯ TSC’s Etsy shop ✯ etsy.com/shop/tarotista 
Arcana Cases
elemental and zodiacal perfumes
custom perfumes based on your sun, moon, and rising!
8 of Wands talisman key chains and luggage tags
9 of Swords blankets
Tarot Podcast merch!
✯ Gift certificates for readings and classes ✯www.tsusanchang.com/shop
✯ The Tarot Podcast memberships and gift memberships ✯patreon.com/thetarotpodcast
✯ The Living Tarot online class ✯tsusanchang.com/class
✯ readings with TSC ✯www.tsusanchang.com/readings
✯ TSC books ✯
Dreaming the Decans (hc/pb): www.lulu.com/shop/t-susan-chang/dreaming-the-decans/hardcover/product-v8kqed2.html
36 Secrets (hc/pb): https://www.lulu.com/shop/t-susan-chang/36-secrets/paperback/product-zzrd79
The Living Tarot: https://www.amazon.com/Living-Tarot-Connecting-Everyday-Readings/dp/0738772259
Tarot Correspondences: https://www.amazon.com/Tarot-Correspondences-Ancient-Secrets-Everyday/dp/0738755125
Tarot Deciphered: https://www.amazon.com/Tarot-Deciphered-Decoding-Esoteric-Symbolism/dp/0738764477

Episode 26: Am I Psychic Enough To Read Tarot? with Mat Auryn

It’s in everybody’s stereotype of the fortune-teller – the dimly lit boudoir, the crystal ball, the embroidered cushions, and on the storefront, a great big sign that says, “PSYCHIC.” But do you really need to be psychic to read the cards? And what does it mean to be psychic, anyway?
In this week’s episode, we look for answers with one of today’s leading voices in all things psychic: Mat Auryn, author of Psychic Witch, The Psychic Art of Tarot and other titles. For many years, Mat read tarot on what you’d have to call the frontline of psychic engagement: Salem, Massachusetts in the month of October.
In our conversation, you’ll learn a bit about what it’s like to be a psychic practitioner—and how you can access your own special abilities to become a better tarot reader.
 
Mat Auryn is an influential author and teacher in occultism and witchcraft. His books Psychic Witch, Mastering Magick, and The Psychic Art of Tarot offer practical insights into psychic and magickal practices. He also co-authored Pisces Witch with Ivo Dominguez, Jr. Mat’s work draws from various spiritual and magickal traditions he’s studied and trained in, aiming to synthesize them in accessible and practical ways. Beyond writing, Mat worked for many years as a professional psychic and tarot reader in Salem, Massachusetts, as well as his own private practice. He is on the faculty at the Omega Institute in Rhinebeck, NY, and co-hosts THE CIRCLE IS podCAST with actress Rachel True. Residing in California’s Bay Area, he co-owns Datura Trading Co. and Modern Witch University. You can find out more information about Mat on his website at www.Auryn.com
Read Mat’s best-selling Psychic Witch
Check out The Psychic Art of Tarot
THE CIRCLE IS podCAST
 
✯✯✯ TAROT GIFT IDEAS for the holidays! ✯✯✯ 
✯ TSC’s Etsy shop ✯ www.etsy.com/shop/tarotista 
Arcana Cases
elemental and zodiacal perfumes
custom perfumes based on your sun, moon, and rising!
8 of Wands talisman key chains and luggage tags
9 of Swords blankets
Tarot Podcast merch!
✯ Gift certificates for readings and classes ✯www.tsusanchang.com/shop
✯ The Tarot Podcast memberships and gift memberships ✯www.patreon.com/thetarotpodcast
✯ The Living Tarot online class ✯www.tsusanchang.com/class
✯ readings with TSC ✯www.tsusanchang.com/readings
✯ TSC books ✯
Dreaming the Decans (hc/pb): www.lulu.com/shop/t-susan-chang/dreaming-the-decans/hardcover/product-v8kqed2.html
36 Secrets (hc/pb): https://www.lulu.com/shop/t-susan-chang/36-secrets/paperback/product-zzrd79
The Living Tarot: https://www.amazon.com/Living-Tarot-Connecting-Everyday-Readings/dp/0738772259
Tarot Correspondences: https://www.amazon.com/Tarot-Correspondences-Ancient-Secrets-Everyday/dp/0738755125
Tarot Deciphered: https://www.amazon.com/Tarot-Deciphered-Decoding-Esoteric-Symbolism/dp/0738764477
 

Episode 25: Reversed Cards

“Oh no!  Some of my cards ended up upside down! What does that mean?!”
In this week’s Try This at Home! segment, we’re having a look at one of the most common matters of debate among tarot readers: how to interpret reversed cards. There are many schools of thought on how to handle reversals, so I’ve put together a brief guide so you can choose what makes sense to you.
If you’ve enjoyed this summary and would love more answers to all your tarot “starter questions,” check out my book, The Living Tarot, available wherever books are sold.  Or, consider The Living Tarot online class (discount for class available if you purchase the book – just email me.)
And if you already use reversals, I’d love to hear your take on how you interpret them! Write to me on the Tarot Podcast Discord server (if you’re a Patreon member - to sign up and support the podcast, visit patreon.com/thetarotpodcast). Or you can reach me through the contact form at thetarotpodcast.com.
Become a Tarot Podcast member! patreon.com/thetarotpodcast
Shop for Tarot Podcast MERCH! & cool stuff made by your host! etsy.com/shop/tarotista
Sign up for readings and explore books and classes!thetarotpodcast.com
Continue your tarot journey with The Living Tarot book and/or The Living Tarot online class (discount for class available if you purchase the book!)
😊 And...don't forget to like, rate, subscribe, and share!! 😊